Christiane Dolva, Head of Sustainability at Fjallraven, still wears her grandmother’s Fjallraven jacket from the 1970s. A firm believer in gear that lasts, she’s working to ensure that every product that comes out of Fjallraven is something that can be passed down.
Now that Christiane is Head of Sustainability at Fjallraven, she wears “the grandma jacket” regularly as a reminder of the brand’s mission to make timeless clothing that lasts. In this episode, Christiane shares how heritage and longevity inform how Fjallraven designs and manufactures their products.
Connect with Fjallraven & Christiane:
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Shelby Stanger: People often pronounce your brand wrong. Can you say it for me?
Christiane Dolv...: It's called Fjällräven.
Shelby Stanger: Yeah. I'm not going to be able to do that.
Christiane Dolv...: Give it a go.
Shelby Stanger: Yeah. Fjällräven.
Christiane Dolv...: Yeah. Almost. Close. It tends to become feel Raven.
Shelby Stanger: That's what I thought. Okay. Fjällräven.
Christiane Dolv...: There's no Raven sound. It's Raven.
Shelby Stanger: Fjällräven.
Christiane Dolv...: Oh good.
Shelby Stanger: Fjällräven, can you do it one more time?
Christiane Dolv...: Fjällräven.
Shelby Stanger: Fjällräven. Okay. We're going to work on this during this podcast episode.
Christiane Dolv...: At the end of it, you'll have it.
Shelby Stanger: I still can't guarantee you that I'm saying it right, but I appreciate Christiane Dolva for giving me that pronunciation lesson. Christiane is the head of sustainability at Fjällräven outdoor apparel. Basically she makes sure that Fjällräven continues to put environmental sustainability at the forefront of their business - and she's clearly doing a good job at it. In 2019, Christiane was named business woman of the year in the Swedish sports industry. She hopped on a call with me, from Sweden to talk about how heritage and longevity inform how Fjällräven designs and manufactures their products. I'm Shelby Stanger. And this is Wild Ideas Worth Living.
Shelby Stanger: Christiane Dolva is from Norway, but she now lives in Sweden. A few years ago she went back to Norway to visit her grandmother. And on that trip, they shared a special moment. A moment that became a tangible reminder of the values that drive her sustainability work at Fjällräven.
Shelby Stanger: You have this great story that I thought we'd start out with about this jacket you have that your grandmother passed down to you. Tell me about this jacket and what makes it so special. And it's, of course, Fjällräven.
Christiane Dolv...: Yeah, the grandma jacket. So my grandmother, she lives in Lillehammer in Norway. And about five years ago, I went home to visit her, and she was like, "Christiane, I have something for you." And she brought me into her closet and there she had like three items in there, there was like this really nice cape, and I think it was even a fur coat. And then this Fjällräven jacket, classic green, it's called Raven. And it still is in our collection today. And she was like, "I want you to have this." And she told me, she bought that jacket in late 1970s and had worn it so much. And she was like, "Now, you work with Fjällräven and I want you to have it."
Shelby Stanger: That is so cool.
Christiane Dolv...: Yeah.
Shelby Stanger: So what did she do in that jacket? Did she tell you about the adventures that the jacket went on with her?
Christiane Dolv...: Yeah, I mean, at first she was just like, "I've used it so much, but I don't use it anymore now. And I think it's cool now that you work with Fjällräven and that you can have it," but then as it grew on me, what happened was I kind of realized that this story is a lot more than just hand-me-down jacket because when I started wearing it and I told this story, I realized that all of a sudden it kind of really symbolizes how we make things that last, and it's not just that it's still not falling apart or that it has a really like timeless design because it looks basically the same as the current version that we have in our collection. But it's also the fact that she kept it, which is like this cool emotional longevity thing that we strive for in our products, making people actually want to keep it and use it year after year.
Christiane Dolv...: So that's when I started asking her about the stories that she had in it. So she was like, "Yeah, but I almost wore it like on a daily basis," which Norwegians tend to do. They wear a lot of outdoor clothing on a daily basis, but she was also like, "Yeah, I remember this time when you were really young and we were up in the mountains hiking." And so it definitely joined her in a lot of adventures and baked a lot of emotional connection into it for me as well.
Shelby Stanger: I love that you said it baked emotional connection into it. So what kind of adventures are you taking it on? And it's so funny because I interviewed Cheryl Strayed, the woman who wrote the book Wild and she's like the Swedes and the Norwegians, those women can hike like no one else. So what do you take your jacket on?
Christiane Dolv...: That's true. I think actually that we tend to be outside a lot probably because we also have so much nature just around the corner that we can play around in. And, as the Norwegian, I tend to think that Norwegians are out even more than Swedes, but that's the friendly competition thing we have going. But for me actually, it's become this really funny thing that I both wear it, the adventures I have in the forests that we have around Stockholm and out in the archipelago. But then it has also really joined me on a different type of adventures, which is traveling the world, talking about sustainability.
Christiane Dolv...: I always bring it because it is such a symbol of what we're striving to do. Even when I went to our suppliers, I wanted the supplier of this particular fabric, the G-1000 fabric that is in the jacket. And I told them the story of like, "Hey, look, this is your fabric that was made into this garment in the seventies. And this is how it looks now." And it was kind of cool to see the reactions of those who have also kind of created the fabric and make them understand that the things that we put so much time and effort and resources into making get to live a long life.
Shelby Stanger: That is so nice. It just kind of says also what kind of woman your grandma was. I mean, she must have been a pretty outdoorsy woman.
Christiane Dolv...: Yep, she was. Not like outdoorsy, I guess as maybe myself for some of us are today where we're like deliberately outdoorsy and seek adventures, but-
Shelby Stanger: Totally, just naturally.
Christiane Dolv...: Yeah. I mean, that was part of her growing up. They had this cabin as a lot of Norwegians do in the mountain, where she spent a lot of time. And also she lived for quite some many years on a farm, which kind of makes you outdoorsy just by running a farm.
Shelby Stanger: So Christiane's grandmother might not have been the type of outdoor adventure woman that we might imagine today. But her story is such a good reminder that there's no wrong way to be outside and for Christiane too ever since she was little being outside has been a built-in part of her everyday life.
Shelby Stanger: Most of our listeners are based in the U.S so maybe you could tell us what it was like to grow up in Norway and also what it's like in Sweden.
Christiane Dolv...: Yeah. So I come from this small village called Lillehammer in Norway, which is kind of basically nowadays known for one thing, which is the winter Olympics that they hosted in 94, which was kind of cool in itself because it's a really tiny village. I think they constructed the first roundabout in the city when we got the Olympics, just because they need that for traffic. But obviously that means that there was a lot of outdoor activities that we did. So I grew up with nature just around the mountains and lakes, and also this family tradition of weekend hikes and stuff like that. And also in the small village where people know each other and spend time outside. And then here in Sweden, it's fairly similar. Right now, I live by the ocean, which is a different part of nature that I really love. In Sweden there is this combination of ocean and water activities, but also a lot of forest and parks and places that are so available.
Shelby Stanger: I just want to go get on a plane right now and go visit you, it sounds incredible. And you have two little kids. How old are they?
Christiane Dolv...: So, they're six and eight.
Shelby Stanger: So they must-
Christiane Dolv...: Two boys.
Shelby Stanger: Oh, boys. So someone just told me the best way to raise children is like outside. So do they like to get outside? And if they do, what do you do with them?
Christiane Dolv...: They love being outside because they're so free. If you give them a bit of time, in the outdoors out in nature, it's so fascinating to see what they kind of end up doing. My 8-year-old, he got into this little period where he was just sitting right in the middle of the blueberry bushes and picking all quiet. And then he like looked at me and he was like, "Mom, do you know what? It feels like it's my body who's just picking while I'm just sitting here, kind of looking inside my brain, figuring out what the thoughts are in there." I was like, "Whoa."
Shelby Stanger: Whoa, your kid just figured out mindfulness and things like Thich Nhat Hanh tries to teach us all. He's eight.
Christiane Dolv...: And then like two minutes later, he was running around with a sword as a stick…still.
Shelby Stanger: That's how it should be. That's great. Wow. It sounds so wonderful where you live, just having a forest right outside your backyard. I mean, I have an ocean, so I can't be ungrateful. I'm very grateful for it, but I'm really curious you're really interested in nature. But How did you get into your line of work? When did you realize you were interested in sustainability and how did you get into the career that you've got into? What path did you take?
Christiane Dolv...: Yeah, it was a little bit of a path that started off in a completely different direction at first, after I graduated, I went to university studying political science and comparative politics. It was with a group of very engaged and clever people. Then we had so many discussions around and everything ranging from geopolitics and ethnic wars to, figuring out how you guys calculate the mandate system behind the presidential election, which I still haven't figured out.
Shelby Stanger: I don't think a lot of us have either. It's okay.
Christiane Dolv...: But after I took my bachelor in that, which is three years, then I was taking it break and just looking at what parts of all those discussions do I really get engaged in. So, that's probably when I realized that, "Yeah. Okay. If we start talking about the environment and sustainability, that's when I kind of want to join in on the discussions." So I kind of quickly found out but yeah how can companies contribute to sustainable development? So, that's where it started. And then I was a consultant for six years and I got some assignments within the outdoor industry. And that was like, "I found home." It was literally like, "Can I do this when I like marry my passion for being outside in nature with my passion, for making companies more sustainable?" So I really found home when I landed in Philadelphia and started that work that I'm doing now.
Shelby Stanger: I love that Christiane found a home in her career by bringing together business and sustainability. And I love that she's able to do this at a brand that connects her with heritage. When we come back, Christiane talks about sustainability at Fjällräven, and some of the incredible long lasting products they make.
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Shelby Stanger: Working in the outdoor industry, provides a totally unique experience and a constant reminder of how amazing our earth is. But working in this industry also comes with the responsibility to take care of the outdoors. What does sustainability look like Fjällräven? Which I'm still not saying right.
Christiane Dolv...: You'll get it. Well, sustainability at Fjällräven is not the sideshow. It's like truly, really embedded and integrated into the core of what we're doing. And we want to make long lasting timeless equipment. It's both, how do we create sustainable growth? But how do we create sustainable products? How do we cater for events and experiences that are more sustainable? And it's also a group of people now globally that are so passionate about these topics. Sometimes working as a consultant, I could feel like my job was being enough in people's face so that they realized that they needed to think about sustainability, and at Fjällräven it's a bit more me running when everyone else is also running and try to just ensure that we're running in the right direction or in the same direction.
Shelby Stanger: That's awesome. You mentioned in a blog on the company website that you're excited about the innovation and technology, that's redefining how companies look at sustainability. Can you give me some examples of what that looks like?
Christiane Dolv...: Yeah, because I think... I mean, especially the word innovation is sometimes, or at least few years back, I could sometimes feel that sustainability was more of the party pooper kind of thing that came in and said, "No, we need to do less of this and less of that, the cut down here and reduce here, which is necessary." But then also now with looking at it for example, new business models of how we can RIM companies, not necessarily based on the linear develop and sell products, that is innovation that I find truly interesting. And then also looking at the textile industry in general, the level of innovation that is going on in material creation and in production processes, which is helped by new technologies and how we understand data and can measure progress and stuff. That is so exciting.
Shelby Stanger: Is there anything you can share that you guys are measuring right now?
Christiane Dolv...: Yeah, I mean, measurements are always harder than you think they are when they start collecting data. The most exciting thing I think that we're doing right now obviously, is to build on the tools that are made available in the industry. Like for example, through the sustainable apparel coalition, where they have this higg index, where you look at different materials and try to measure their impact on the environment, that's one of the things I could probably spend 210% of my time doing is researching what materials are better than others from a sustainability point of view. And it's really not black and white because it's so many different parameters that you look at. And then also I think there is a lot of exciting things going on in what is like my heart passion project of creating durable long lasting timeless, grandma jackets.
Shelby Stanger: Yeah. Talk to me about that because it's one thing to create a product with material that's built to last, but how do you also make it look cool? Obviously the seventies are kind of in right now. So fitting that's something in the seventies is still hot today, but that's challenging. How do you make timeless pieces built to last aesthetically and materially?
Christiane Dolv...: That's a really good question. I love that you pick up on that because the conversation around your ability tends to stay with the physical properties of making something that can last for wear and tear, but it is a lot more than that. Because it doesn't matter if you move a jacket that can last first 35 years, if the person who gets it grows tired of it, the next season, and that's where the time was design comes in. These are things that are very much integrated into what we call our design philosophy. So our designers have all these guidelines where timeless design is one it's about looking at simplicity, not adding anything, unless it actually has to function. It's about looking at color choices and how you can make color choices that hopefully are more timeless. It's about, having the guts, not to necessarily for low short-term trends, but stick to your DNA.
Christiane Dolv...: And I think it's also about functionality. I mean, we do create our products because we believe that we can create products that make an outdoor experience more comfortable or more enjoyable or have a seamless nice experience would get the equipment. If you own a product that has an aesthetic that is like simple and a color, that's not necessarily the seasons trend color. And then it also has this great features, functionality wise. That's all factors that I believe plays into creating those products that you just want to clean onto and keep on [inaudible 00:17:20] .
Shelby Stanger: Yeah. I love that. I mean, so you're not going to go buy a jacket with like that's bedazzled because sparkles are only in for very temporary. It's going to be solid and pretty and maybe have a good colored blocker. Yeah. I only asked him because I love keeping old jackets, but I get tired of things because I'm a product of Southern California trends. Can't help myself sometimes.
Christiane Dolv...: But I think that's natural. And I mean, we all, obviously, at least those of us in our part of the world, tend to purchase things at the spur of the moment. Those purchasing decisions are not necessarily driven by a thought that this I'm going to have. And then hand down to my grandchild. It's obviously one of the more tricky ones. And I think that there's probably those of stuff that we don't really understand how it happens in it as well. So take, for example, the Kanken backpack, the small square backpack with the red folks on it.
Shelby Stanger: Oh yeah. My neighbors, I had two of those and I gave one to the neighbor kids because they were tiny and they will not wear it to school every single day.
Christiane Dolv...: And that is so... To us still fascinating because that was created in the seventies, by our founder who was reading this article about school children in Sweden, suffering from back problems because everyone at the time was wearing these shoulder bags with their heavy school books in. So he literally, took one of these binders and started playing around with that shape of figuring out, a simple shape that will fit what you need to school and not making it too complicated and create the Kanken backpack. And there's definitely a simplicity to it because it's very straightforward construction, but obviously there are also elements to it as why it's all over the world right now that we ourselves also sometime like, "Yeah, how did that happen?"
Shelby Stanger: That is interesting. I'm glad you told me this story about that backpack. Because I see those backpacks everywhere. I mean, they're really well-made but so simple, and it all comes back to your grandma's jacket made in the seventies built to last and it's getting a second life via you. Are you going to pass those down to your kids, that jacket?
Christiane Dolv...: Yeah, I can really hope so. I mean, I think obviously when a product has a journey that is that long, it becomes something more than just a jacket and it's like to me right now, especially now when I can't really travel to Norway. Do you know the current situation with travel bands and stuff? It feels like I'm carrying a bit of my grandma with me when I wear it. And definitely, I hope that that jacket will stay in the family. But I also hope that some of the newer products that I have from Fjällräven now are going to be the ones that my kids pick up when they get older. And we'll be like, "Yeah, this is nice."
Shelby Stanger: Do you have any other examples of products like your grandma's jacket that people have passed down for generations and just love them?
Christiane Dolv...: Yeah, we do. And we actually started collecting them now.
Shelby Stanger: How cool.
Christiane Dolv...: Yeah, through like Fjällräven heritage stories because we realized... I mean, I realized that if I'm on stage and tell the grandma jacket story, there is almost for certain, especially if I'm in a Scandinavian country, someone coming up to me afterwards and be like, "I have one, it's from my uncle or from my grandmother or grandfather." So, that happens on a personal level a lot. But then we also, once we started asking and looking around for it, we've had people sending products to us together with family photos and be like, "I have this," there was this one children's coverall that we don't have in the collection anymore now that was like purchased in Sweden and used by child here. And then she moved to Australia and now her children are using it in Australia.
Christiane Dolv...: And there's a lot of those stories around. And I was really happy also to see that when I was... I think it was when I was in Canada, in our store in Vancouver, that they had had someone coming to the store with an old Fjällräven backpack and be like, "Hey, do you guys want to have this in your store? Because I've had it for so long," and told the story of what he'd been doing with it and so on.
Shelby Stanger: That is so cool.
Christiane Dolv...: Probably the one thing that makes me most proud of the work that we're doing about everything else.
Shelby Stanger: I think it's awesome that Christiane has a grandma jacket that she wears now and maybe she'll even pass it down to her children. Maybe Christiane wears this jacket outdoors for different reasons than her grandma did, but every relationship with the outdoors can be meaningful. How can we all feel included and the responsibility to have a healthy earth down to the next generation? A huge thank you to Christiane Dolva for talking to me, you can learn more about Fjällräven on their website @fjällräven.com. That's F-J-A-L-L-R-A-V-E-N.com or at Fjällräven social media.
Shelby Stanger: Wild Ideas Worth Living is part of the REI podcast network. It's hosted by me, Shelby Stanger, written and edited by Sylvia Thomas and produced by Chelsea Davis. Our executive producers are Paolo Mottola and Joe Crosby and our presenting sponsor this season is Subaru. As always we appreciate when you subscribe, rate and review the show, wherever you listen, we read every single review. They mean a ton to us and remember some of the best adventures happen when you follow your wildest ideas.