Kimi Werner is a world champion spearfisher, ocean advocate, and chef whose life centers on sustainable fishing, food, and a deep connection to nature. After winning the largest spearfishing competition in the world in 2008, she stepped away from competition to focus on feeding her community and cooking with fish she harvests. Her upcoming cookbook, Kimi’s Kitchen, blends recipes and memoir to explore living well through the ocean, the land, and family.
Kimi Werner is a world champion spearfisher, ocean advocate, and chef whose life centers on sustainable fishing, food, and a deep connection to nature. After winning the largest spearfishing competition in the world in 2008, she stepped away from competition to focus on feeding her community and cooking with fish she harvests. Her upcoming cookbook, Kimi’s Kitchen, blends recipes and memoir to explore living well through the ocean, the land, and family.
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Shelby Stanger:
Off the coast of Oahu, Kimi Werner holds her breath and dives down 70 to 100 feet below the surface of the ocean.
Kimi Werner:
The more time that you spend in the water and the more time that you take baby steps into learning to slow down your heart rate, learning to calm your nervous system, it becomes the most calming feeling in the world. There's no other place like it. It is a place that just demands my presence to this day. And I love that the only thoughts going through my head are present thoughts. They're thoughts in observing what's in front of me, and that is the most cleansing feeling that I could ever ask for.
Shelby Stanger:
Deep underwater, Kimi hears the sound of her heartbeat and the slow rhythm of the ocean as she looks for fish to catch. In 2008, Kimi won the largest spearfishing competition in the world. She still spearfishes multiple times a week, but these days she's more focused on connecting with nature and feeding her friends and family. Food has always been a central part of Kimi's relationship with the ocean. She has a big garden at home and she loves preparing the fish she catches with homegrown and local ingredients. This spring, she's coming out with a cookbook that's part recipes and part memoir, called Kimi's Kitchen. This is the second time we've had Kimi on the show. When we last spoke in 2017, her career was just taking off. Since then, it's flourished, and she's also become a mom to her six-year-old son, Buddy.
I'm Shelby Stanger, and this is Wild Ideas Worth Living, an REI Co-op Studios production presented by Capital One and the REI Co-op Mastercard.
Kimi Werner, welcome back to Wild Ideas Worth Living. I'm really, really excited to talk to you. First off, since we last talked, so much in your world has changed. You got married, you have a baby who's not a baby anymore, a young little boy, buddy, and you have a new book baby. So much to talk about. Thank you for coming back on the show. I really appreciate it.
Kimi Werner:
Thank you so much for having me. Yeah, it is quite incredible. I remember being just so engaged with our first conversation and it feels absolutely nostalgic to be back here talking to you again, especially after so many huge milestones in life.
Shelby Stanger:
It's just been really exciting to watch your evolution. I don't even know where we start, but I remember there was this memory for me on our last conversation and you were very vulnerable and authentic, which is one of the pieces of your brand I respect so much, your authenticity. And then since then you've gone on, you have these huge shows. I saw you recently with Gordon Ramsey, Brad Leone, who was on this show. Where do you want to start? I'm going to let you pick it.
Kimi Werner:
I mean, I guess when you ask me where I want to start, what has been the most substantial thing since, I can't help, but just have to start with motherhood. Since we last talked, like you said, I had a baby who's no longer a baby. Now he's about to turn six, but that was definitely the biggest game changer of all, for sure.
Shelby Stanger:
Tell me how it changed your life. I mean, I've seen videos of Buddy all over your Instagram and now he's fishing with you and doing all sorts of fun things with you and he's cooking. And he probably has the best lunches out of any kid I know because you make them.
Kimi Werner:
Yeah. And he's definitely a foodie. I love his appreciation for food. We share that a lot. But I would say one thing that was always clear to me in this outdoor space, and especially when it comes to the underwater world, one thing I never saw were mothers. I never saw mothers continuing on. And I think that was something that always made me sad. I mean, first of all, when it comes to free diving, spearfishing, there weren't really a lot of women in that space to begin with. And so in my mind, I think the message I started to get and the only narrative I started to create was that I really had to put that off, put it as far in the future as I could because I was so in love with free diving. I was so into spearfishing for my own food.
And almost everyone that I did that with, they were men. And I watched them become fathers one by one and whatnot. And they would always encourage me and say, "See, you can do it too." But I just look at them and like, "Your wife is at home nursing your baby. It's not the same." And then I started to make a living off of doing this. I started to get professional sponsors and partners like Patagonia and Yeti and OluKai and all these other great brands that I felt so, so grateful for, but when I found out that I was pregnant, I couldn't help but think of what value am I going to be now? I know that when I have this baby, I'm going to want to stay put for a while.
At that point in life, I was just flying all over the world, doing all types of adventures underwater. And my bags were just pretty much always packed or in the process of being repacked. So there was a lot of fears and a lot of vulnerability going into that phase.
Shelby Stanger:
Tell me a little bit about some of those adventures you were doing then? Because I think a lot of people don't know. I mean, you were the world champion spearfisher woman, which is a very interesting sport. What is it to be a National Spearfishing Champion?
Kimi Werner:
Yeah. To be a National Spearfishing Champion felt amazing. When I won that title, it was actually my first time ever diving outside of Hawaii in my life when I entered that competition, which was the national championships. And a lot of hard work and also a lot of good luck all came together that day. And I did walk away with that title. And it felt wonderful. It felt wonderful to represent my home and just to truly accomplish a goal. But my time spent competing was pretty minimal after that because I also realized that that's not exactly what my heart was into. My heart wasn't into really looking at fish as points or spearfishing as competition as much as it was a sustainable lifestyle to feed me and to get me to truly explore. It was never lost on me how grateful I was to be doing this and how much I loved it.
Shelby Stanger:
After winning the championship in 2008, Kimi landed brand sponsorships that sent her traveling the world. She swam with narwhals in the Arctic, orcas in Norway, and penguins in Antarctica. But after nearly a decade of constant travel, Kimi missed Hawaii and she found herself craving a deeper sense of home. Around that same time, she became pregnant with her son, Buddy. Kimi knew that motherhood would reshape her career, but she was able to make it work. Today, Kimi dives in the ocean near her home as often as she can, hunting, filming, and exploring the marine landscape. Every day is a little bit different, and that's part of the thrill.
I recently started dabbling into free diving. I won't even call it free diving. I'll say snorkeling while diving deeper to collect some things. You can't help but calm your nervous system and feel absolutely incredible underwater. I think the other thing about underwater exploration is like on land, we have AllTrails. So much of it is predictable a little bit. Underwater, nothing is predictable. So there's so many moments to experience awe and magic and wonder and mystery and discovery.
Kimi Werner:
It's absolutely true. I mean, today I went in the water and it was just the most calm, clean, serene ocean you can imagine. And I found myself just getting lost in the magic of the bubbles, just getting lost in the magic of coming up from a dive and seeing how the sun is shining through the surface and just flickering and distorting itself. And I was just like, "How could you not believe in magic just looking at this?" And all I was looking at was light and bubbles.
And yesterday I was in the ocean and we were spearfishing, we were looking for these big pelagic fish called Oahu to bring home. And there were so many sharks and big Galapagos sharks and they were being really aggressive and they're cute little hammerhead sharks and there are whales breaching everywhere. And it was just insane.
Shelby Stanger:
Where exactly were you?
Kimi Werner:
Yeah, this is right on the north shore of Oahu. And yesterday it was just my husband and I. It is always really important when you go free diving to always have a dive partner. A lot of times it's just my husband Justin and I, and that's how it was yesterday. And so we went out, we were in close to 200 feet of water. And so we're in the deep blue sea and we're in an area where we know that these pelagic fish swim through. It's very hit or miss when you're going for pelagic fish or as we say, like blue water fish. It's not like you're diving to the bottom of the ocean, finding structure or reefs or habitats where you know you can find fish. It's like you are out in the blue and you might see nothing like today, or you could just see a lot.
And so yesterday we did see some Oahu, or we call them Ono here in Hawaii. And so there are these large predator top of the food chain fish. They're big and they're absolutely delicious. But yeah, so one came in, it wasn't a very big one. It was maybe 16 to 18 pounds. And my husband, Justin, was able to shoot it. And it's only his second time, that's his second Ono he's ever shot. So, I was just cheering him on, so proud of him, just trying to poke my head up and coach him and be like, "Okay, now keep tension on it and start bringing it in." And right as I said that we just saw these sharks. And there were no sharks around prior to that, or at least that we didn't see them, but the vibrations of a fish that had just been speared, so the fish in distress, I mean, that will bring sharks in way faster. People think like, oh, blood will bring sharks in, and it can, but nowhere near as fast as the dinner bell going off of a fish in distress.
Sharks have these lateral lines on their bodies just made specifically for picking up vibrations. And so it was crazy. When I put my head back in the water and I just saw this huge Galapagos shark just swimming vertically up from the depths at a speed that I can't even fathom. It is insane. It's something that you can't even grasp. And now I'm seeing it's not just that shark. There's another one and another one. They're all coming up. And if that one shark commits and takes a bite, the minute one bite is taken, that's when the frenzy starts. And so as soon as I saw that, I just swam towards that shark. And I'm not recommending people to do this, but I just heard myself underwater roar like a lion, really just from the gut, I roared and I just swam at that shark.
And it's not that I'm not scared, this shark again was so fast that it's very counterintuitive to be swimming at it, but it's more like I almost just need to psych myself up so much right now with so much alpha energy because that's the energy that this shark is giving off. And so I just roared like a lion, hoping that energy would even go through the water too, but more so it's just my body language just like swimming at that shark. And thank goodness at the last second it turned. And then we had a Jet Ski that we were diving off of. And so he was swimming towards the Jet Ski and pulling the fish in and then another shark did the exact same thing and I again had to meet it head on. And so while he was trying to get his fish on the ski, I was just basically there poking off sharks.
And I actually did have to just push a few away with my spear. I didn't pull trigger or anything, but I'm definitely just like, that's how close we are. So it's really, really important. And that was really hard with just two people, but I mean-
Shelby Stanger:
Well, that was just a Thursday.
Kimi Werner:
That was yesterday morning. Yeah.
Shelby Stanger:
That's bananas, Kimi.
Kimi Werner:
It's right out there in the yard. I was going to bring it into my office and show you though what we landed. It's really cool.
Shelby Stanger:
Were you scared when you charged the shark?
Kimi Werner:
That was fear for sure. I think when people see me do that, they're like, "Wow, you're so fearless." But no, that's actually pure fear. It's just transforming it into something different. And I think that is literally a skill I've had to learn in life that the sharks have taught me is that because when I see sharks and they're charging, it's not that I don't feel scared. It's just that I understand that I need to turn my fear into something more useful. And I know that I have to not freeze in fear or not swim away in fear because although that might feel like the instinct that fear tells you to do, it makes absolutely no sense to swim away and flail your fins and act like prey in front of an angry predator. That would be way dangerous. And so it's legitimately doing the safest thing by harnessing that courage and matching that energy.
And sharks teach me so much in life because they certainly taught me public speaking because I, oh man, talk about a fear, that was something that I was just petrified of. And when I was in college and I would try to, I had to give talks and reports in front of the class, I just sucked at it so badly. And I would know my material, I would know what I wanted to say, but the minute I got up in front of a crowd of people and I heard my voice, I could hear the fear, I could hear the nervousness in my voice. And when I would hear it, I would think about it more and then I would try to speak a lot faster to hurry it up because it was so uncomfortable and I was trying to suppress my fear so much that I was focused more on suppressing my fear than I was on remembering what I had to say. And it was terrible every single time.
And finally, one of my best friends just said to me, she's like, "You know what's interesting?" She said, "If you can actually harness that stress and know that it's there to serve you, you might be able to turn it into something more useful." And instantly I thought about the sharks and I thought about, "It's not that I'm not scared of them, I'm totally scared, but I know that that energy can serve me if I turn it into something powerful." And so when I did my first TED Talk, all the same things started happening and this time instead of trying to fight it and suppress it, I just said, "Hey, beating heart, you're here again and you're really making a presence. And hey, sweaty palms, I still will never understand what your purpose is and why you show up, but I know that you guys are showing up because you are some form of energy that is going through me because you know I'm about to deliver."
And I think basically that's what fear is. Fear is not the enemy. Fear is a friend that we need to invite to the table.
Shelby Stanger:
The day before our interview, Kimi Werner and her husband were spearfishing off the north shore of Oahu when they hooked a giant tuna. As they swam to the surface, sharks began circling. Instead of trying to retreat, Kimi charged straight toward the sharks. It was a moment of instinct and clarity, a perfect example of how she's learned to recognize fear, harness it, and turn it into courage. But I couldn't stop thinking about what came next.
What happened when you got back onto the jet ski?
Kimi Werner:
Once we got back on the jet ski, they were just swarming around us. And I mean, the fins were out of the water. We took our time because so much of Justin's shooting line and stuff was tangled, we still needed to just take care of, open up a fish bag, fill it up. We had to do a lot of stuff. And so it took us a good amount of time. And the whole time we were on that Jet Ski, we just kept looking down and be like, "My gosh, these sharks are still just following us." They stuck with us for a really long time.
Shelby Stanger:
And on a jet ski, you're not that high out of the water.
Kimi Werner:
No. No, not at all. And it's not that big. We are two people on one ski. It's very small and now a big fish, so it's like very limited real estate, but we were just so happy. After that, we enjoyed the ocean a bit more. I was like, "I don't want to dive with any more sharks today." So we went a little shallower and spent some time in the shallows and then we were both like, "We don't need more fish. Let's go home and just get this thing in a cooler." And so we were just stoked, just so happy.
Shelby Stanger:
I'm really excited for you to eat this. Are you cooking it tonight for dinner?
Kimi Werner:
We are debating cutting it. The thing about these fish is, I mean, they're so great. They're so delicious. And I think a lot of people have the misconception when it comes to fish that make really good sashimi, just really high quality fish that the fresher, the better. But in actuality, when a fish is this good, you don't want to cut it the same day that you caught it. You want to let it rest on ice. You want to ice it, take really good care of it, always keep the plug of your cooler cracked open because you don't want it to ever sit in fresh water. You only want it to touch ice, but not ever be submerged in fresh water. And you can cut it the next day. You can cut it on day two, day three, day four. Those are prime times.
Just letting it age on ice for a day or two and letting that protein just relax, that's what's going to make the sashimi extra soft, extra buttery, extra melt in your mouth. If you try to cut it the same day that you catch it to eat it raw, it'll still be delicious, but it will be a little more chewy. It'll definitely just not be the same melt in your mouth bite of fish. If you're going to cook it doesn't really matter. Go ahead. But we plan on doing everything. We plan on eating this in an assortment of ways. We definitely plan on sharing it with our community. And I would say most people in the community know the value of this fish and are going to want to eat it raw. And so we considered cutting it today, but now we're both feeling like we think tomorrow's the right call.
Shelby Stanger:
How's it been teaching Buddy to fish?
Kimi Werner:
It's like these pinch me moments when I get to spend time with Buddy on the water or I'm spearfishing and he's floating along next to me. And I think because I knew that I wanted that so much with him, I was so careful that I didn't want to ever push it on him, never want to force him to do it. And when we first started taking him out to the ocean, oh my goodness, he was the most seasick baby you could imagine. And so I was like, "Wow, this might not happen." And he still gets seasick here and there, but he's getting a lot better. He's acclimating a lot more, but I'm so happy that it is something that he keeps coming back to. And to see him swimming around like a little fish while I'm spearfishing and just trying to help me bring it in or help me whatever, those are my favorite memories for sure.
Shelby Stanger:
I think it's so cool that you've brought Buddy so deeply into your world as a mother. And I know you're scared to tell brands that were sponsoring you, "Hey, I'm now having a kid," but your own father taught you how to spearfish. It was passed on by a parent. Talk to me a little bit about that.
Kimi Werner:
Yeah. I got introduced to the underwater world and I got introduced to the whole concept of free diving and spearfishing from my own dad. And I was Buddy's age when I did. I was five years old. And basically at that time, my parents didn't have much money at all. They were struggling to make ends meet financially. And so that is why my dad went diving is because that was his way of feeding us. That was his way of saving money. We lived in the boonies. We lived in this little shack in Haiku Maui and he would go diving whenever he could to put food on the table. And when I was five, he started letting me tag along with him. And so I never touched a spear, nothing like that, but I would just tag along with him. I would just follow him around in the ocean. I would just be mesmerized as I would watch him dive down. It was just, he was the one that introduced me to this underwater world and how magical it feels.
And then it was my mom who we would bring this fish home to. She was the one that really drove in the values of how to honor this catch, how to never waste this catch, how to get as much as we can from it. And sure, it's because we were poor and she was being resourceful, but it was deeper than that. She really had a strong sense of teaching us that we always have to take care of that which takes care of us. And at the time, it was nature taking care of us.
By the time I was seven, both of my parents started making money. They weren't poor my whole childhood. It was only the beginning part of my childhood. Then they both got careers. And so they both then ended up working all the time. Then they both were able to afford a lot more in life and they were really proud of their progress. But I honestly was so sad because we moved out of that little shack in the bushes and we left Haiku and we stopped going to nature for our food. And we lived a very, very civilized, normal life in a subdivision, getting food from grocery stores. And there's nothing wrong with that, but it definitely didn't feel as magical as the poor days.
And it wasn't until then, until after graduating from college and being 24 years old that I finally just realized, "I need to see about this diving stuff." And so that was when I gave it a go and got a simple three-pronged spear. And when I got my first handful of those little fry fish and got to bring it home and cook it up, I just realized this is it. This is everything to me.
Shelby Stanger:
Where did you learn to cook?
Kimi Werner:
My mom and my grandma were great cooks, and so I loved cooking my whole life. And then I went to culinary school, and then I worked in the restaurant industry for a very short amount of time. But at the time I was working in a restaurant where all the ingredients were imported and flown in from afar. There was no story behind them. And it didn't even feel like there was creativity because I was just making the same thing over and over again. And so then I got out of that. And it's so interesting that then after picking up spear fishing, how spearfishing and cooking obviously just go hand in hand. It's very full circle.
Shelby Stanger:
Tell me about this book, Kimi's Kitchen that we'll be releasing probably when this podcast comes out.
Kimi Werner:
Yeah. Talk about a dream that I've always had, that has been it. I have always, always had this fantasy goal of writing a cookbook and that's been a long time coming and now it's here. There's everything from fried fish bones to fish head soup, to really nice, more sophisticated or elegant dishes of pesto cranberry stuffed fish filets. There's garlic fish. There's super easy baked fish. And it's not all fish. There's my mom's lasagna. There's recipes for venison. So basically the book is, it's a love story to nature and it's a biography of my journey. And so the first chapter of recipes is about my roots and they're the resourceful recipes that I got from my parents and that I got from those early days. It's a chapter called Travel. And it's from the times when I was traveling around the world, dishes inspired by my time in Thailand or in the Azores, Portugal.
And every chapter has stories, stories and photos and people who just mean the whole world to me. And there's a chapter of Buddy, of food that I love to cook with my son and eat with my son. A lot of the photos are from my adventures all over the world, and a lot of them are just right here in our own backyard. But every single part of this is filled with heart and filled with intention, and I could not be more proud of it.
Shelby Stanger:
Kimi's cookbook called Kimi's Kitchen is out now everywhere books are sold. If you want to learn more about Kimi and what she's up to, check her out on Instagram @kimiswimmy. That's K-I-M-I S-W-I-M-M-Y.
Wild Ideas Worth Living is part of the REI Podcast Network. It's hosted by me, Shelby Stanger, produced by Annie Fassler, Sylvia Thomas, and Sam Peers Nitzberg of Puddle Creative. Our senior producer is Jenny Barber. Our executive producers are Paolo Mottola and Joe Crosby. Thanks again to our partner, Capital One and the REI Co-op Mastercard. As always, we love when you follow the show, take time to rate it and write a review wherever you listen. And remember, some of the best adventures happen when you follow your wildest ideas.